Stream, future of PVP, Gunsmith
- They have always been mindful against having a system where you can get griefed by someone killing you over and over again out in Patrol. They tried to setup Gambit in a way where the PVP element was intermittent and you still felt like you were contributing to the team if you were not a strong PVP player. (Forums)
- They're removing non-gunsmith weapons from banshee's loot pool next Tuesday. While this isn't specifically reducing the cost, your chances of getting that god roll Erentil will be increased. They'll keep monitoring feedback and passing it to the team as it comes in. (Reddit)
- Crucible isn't going anywhere. (Twitter)
Stream. (part 1)
Is Gambit and Gambit Prime Bungie’s vision for the future of the Destiny franchise?
Robbie: It’s a hard no. We specifically set out to build Gambit as its own experience. What that meant was that it eventually became a PVEPVP experience, we wanted to focus on competition between two teams, showing the best they can at their PVE skills while competing against another group. Eventually we laid PVP on because that’s what we found to be the most fun experience.
Peter: Then when we brought the mode out we were very conscious of trying to deliver that message that this is not Crucible, so that’s why Gambit does not live in the same space as the Crucible does. Shaxx does not narrate, does not host Gambit. It got its own character, The Drifter. It’s separate mode, separate space, separate activity. PVEPVP not the same as PVP.
DeeJ: If I can add to that… I know there has been a lot of community chatter about the Crucible. There has been a lot of speculations about our plans. We want to absolutely go on record and say that there are members of the development team who come into Bungie every day to work on Destiny, and they are hard at work upstairs right now on future evolutions for the Crucible. I know that my saying that… creates a million new questions about how that stuff gonna work, and how that stuff gonna be, and when we’re going to learn about that stuff and… this is a Bungie Bounty stream, it’s not a reveal stream. These are curiosities I can satisfy, they’re not questions I can answer right now. As sorry as I am to leave you hanging, we want to pick the right moment and right people to deliver that message.
Reddit addendum: Sorry this was confusing. It was a live fire exercise. This is why I like to write shit down and let a dozen people look at it before we F5. Anyway, what I really meant to say was that the Crucible is going to grow from where it is currently. The essence of the Crucible, being pure PvP, will remain; but there will be changes. Rpaulv, keep an eye on our careers page. (Reddit)
Was there ever an iteration of Gambit/Prime that did not have the invader? I am curious if that was part of the original idea.
Peter: It wasn’t. In fact, the original plan for Gambit was to have two teams in separate arenas and one of the pillars was that those two teams should never directly interact with eachother. We always knew that we wanted each team to affect the other, but we originally were saying you can’t ever shoot eachother. We weren’t able to make that as exciting as we wanted, we always had the question of if I can’t shoot them, why do I care about the other team? We knew we were always going to have that question, and people are going to ask “Why can’t we shoot the other team?” So we figured that we should at least try it, so we have a concrete answer so we could say “We tried it but it couldn’t work because of this reason.” So, we tried it and in fact it worked really, really well. We knew from that very first playtest of the first invasion that it was going to be the special sauce that made Gambit really sing, and we never looked back. We took a red pen across that design pillar of no direct player interaction, and from that moment forward invading was the core of the Gambit experience.
Robbie: I think there was a world for us to create a core of like two teams doing a PVE only experience. I definitely think there is room for that in Destiny. But it’s one of those things as we were working on thing, we were just all so excited about the idea of another player coming into to be that interference, we came up with a lot of ideas that we called interferences. It ranged from things of you controlling ogres, or dropping bombs on the other team… We were getting excited about it, and it was fun. We had it set up to so you could drop combatants on the other side (which became Blockers). Invasions was the thing that was the sauce, that really made the stew of Gambit taste really good.
Peter: When you do something and you find magic in a game, you don’t walk away from it. Once we tried it out, once we tasted that forbidden fruit, there was no way we could ever go back to the version that didn’t have it.
There is a lot of times you can get caught up in this debate of “we should do this, we shouldn’t do this”, just do it! Just try it. When you try it and play it, you know. That’s what happened here.
Robbie: It takes a long time to get a mode or mechanic even just a simple mechanic to the point where it feels really good, and shippable, so that a large audience can play it. Great thing about playtesting is that we can string some stuff together, and it can be really ugly. The first invasion portal was actually the portal from the Subclass acquisition missions in the Dark Forest. The first Bank was a weird triangle that we slapped some Cabal monitors to.
Are you going to make any changes to how much you can invade during the Primeval phase?
Robbie: With 2.2.1 we’re making two changes to invasions during Primeval phase. One is we’re touching the portal cooldown, which currently is 30 seconds and we’re increasing that to 40 seconds during the Primeval phase only. That cooldown is triggered when either the Invader returns from a successful invasion, or when the invader dies. Right now, you’ve noticed a lot of times on stream invaders are coming right before the last Wizard dies, our hope here is that the extra ten seconds will either allow that team who is fighting the envoys more time to do some more DPS. Another thing we’re doing is reducing the amount of health that invaders will heal the Primeval. Currently is 12%, we’re reducing that to 8%. That way players can’t lose as much progress when an invader is coming in.
How do you decide on these changes?
Peter: Some of it is we playing the game by ourselves, we play exactly the way [normal players] do, we have to earn everything. We come back the next day and talk to eachother, and say man I feel like the invaders are coming way to often. So, we talk about it and figure out what we want to do about that, and how we think it’s going to change things.
Robbie: We always wanted the Invader to have a huge impact during the Primeval phase, it just felt a little bit too powerful. It didn’t feel crazy far off, I will go out there and say we didn’t think the experience was widely out of tuning. It felt we could hone into that tuning a little bit.
Any plans to adjust the burn on the Primeval?
Robbie: I think because of the invader changes we talked about earlier, we want to see how that lands before we touch the burn. It’s something we’re looking at, something we’re being aware of and monitoring. But we want to see how those invader changes land first.
Any plans to allow Prime armor sets to be relevant in regular Gambit?
Peter: In designing the Gambit armor, the Prime armor, we specifically wanted to sandbox it, to put it into only Prime and keep it constrained there. That allowed us to be more free with what we do with those perks, so a lot of those design perks that were specific to some of the mechanics in Prime. For instance, there are no giant blockers in regular gambit so that top tier collector perk doesn’t make sense in regular Gambit. So if we allowed you to bring all those things to regular Gambit, Gambit becomes Gambit Prime. Keeping them separate gave us more freedom to develop cool perks without worrying how those perks would ripple outward to the rest of the game.
If you like OG gambit, you can still play that. If you like the spiciness of Prime and you like those armorsets, you can take those into prime.
Robbie: You’re paying for the Annual Pass, and we wanted to give you something cool. Prime is the cool thing given to you.
How come Kell’s Grave and Cathedral of Scars are incompatible with Gambit Prime?
Robbie: There’s a lot of things that go on during the development during these releases, it just kinda came down to resources. I think another factor is that some players have a really hard time with those death drops and we’ve gotten a lot of feedback about that. So, time resources plus some of that feedback. We decided that the best thing for the release is to focus on two brand new maps and adding a bunch of new stuff to Legion’s Folly and Emerald Coast to get those up and running. I know sometimes from an observation standpoint “Why can’t all the maps just be on?”, actually a lot of development time has to go into making even the old maps work for prime, there were a lot of things we had to do.
Peter: The Encounters were all different, we had to put the envoys in place, make sure the balance is right.
Robbie: We really try to actually play everything before we ship. Sometimes it’s hard to hear, but it’s just kind of reality of development time.
Peter: It’s not that those maps are incompatible with Prime, it’s just Prime isn’t there yet. In the future maybe that’s something that could happen, there is nothing inherent in those maps that say it can never be in Prime. We just didn’t have time or resources this time around.
Are there plans to adjust perks and impactfullness of Gambit Prime sets? Are there any plans to adjust player frustrations around Gambit Prime set triumphs?
Robbie: We’ve been looking at our data a lot, especially now that players have started to get those T3 perks and started to unlock the armor. What we’re finding is that the difference between the sets the players are wearing all the time when they’re playing the game mode are pretty close to one another. Invader’s at the top, then it’s Reaper, Collector, Sentry. Now as the development team we expected Collector and Sentry to be a little bit lower on the spectrum just because they’re a little bit more specialized. Invasion is so important it’s no surprise that Invader and Reaper are at the top. The delta between the number of people wearing Invader armor and Sentry armor isn’t that far, it’s only a few percentage points. In terms of people identifying their roles and leaning into the roles, it is what the community is doing. We didn’t know what would happen, but everyone is finding their niche, and filling it.
Peter: One of the challenges with a set like the Sentry is that the top tier perk is something that is a little bit harder to feel in the same way that you can feel the top tier collector perk of depositing 20 motes and getting a giant blocker, you notice that. The top tier perk in the Sentry is a little but more subtle, it’s buffing your team with little visual reinforcement. I think it comes down to feeling you get from being that role and wanting to see it manifest. Maybe we could do a better job with the sentry to really make you feel like you’re getting that top tier perk.
Robbie: The goal of the sentry was always that you’re slaying the Taken, the Blockers, you’re helping fight the Invader, you’re killing the Primeval. That’s why the top tier perk was all about the Well of Light. If we’re going to look at the perks, that one you feel the least. It’s actually very good and you can feel and notice the difference if you know the tuning of the game and you’re really into stats and stuff. That’s not as accessible as just drop that 20 Blocker, or get a bunch of grenade energy.